BILL'S NTERVIEW WITH NONIE, OCTOBER 1, 1972.

B: Tell us first of all about your parents and we will try to go back beyond there. Now your mother was from where?

N: My mother was from Schlewig Holstein, one of the northern provinces of Germany. Her mother's mother claimed to have royal blood from the family that was in power in Spain in the 1700's it would be as near as they can generalize on dates and she came up to France to meet her lover, who had been down there from Alsace Lorraine, and he of course was mostly German, and she went up there to meet him (by the way she had on one of the original paisley shawls as the design was made in Spain and belonging to the upper class socially she wore one of these as her trousseau. I have that shawl and I have offered it for sale to the museum in Los Angeles, but they said they had no money. When I go back I want to place that some place in a museum where it can be enjoyed by many, and yet it could come from our family. My mother's father was of German heritage and the sole heir to the home and it was just like a small castle on the S -1 , the river which comes in from Hamburg into Germany. They had this small castle there with grounds around there. When I was there I had the privilege of visiting there when I was a girl of 14. and it was a park and there were wild deer in that park which I just felt was simply wonderful to see them playing around there and also they had a wharf down on the river with a small boat. We went out on that because that was where he had his boat and where my mother had been born in that place, but they lost all their money and he got interested too much in race horses Fast horses and fast women, I guess. but anyway, he died and left eight children. and my grandmother, who was the one who had the Spanish blood in her, take over and her eldest son was named Pete, and I have a grandson by the name of Peter and I was, telling him this story because he has inherited that name from our side of the family.

B: I was through Schlewig Holstein very briefly in 1963 and into Hamburg and I understand that part of Germany has at times belonged to Denmark and at times to Germany the border has shifted. The area where your mother came from....

N: ... from Schlewig, my father came from Holstein and it was in Denmark.

B: I see but it is now part of Germany.

N: No, it isn't it is now back under Danish rule.

B: So the area where your mother came from has always been part of Germany.

N: Yes.

B: When approximately did your mother emigrate to the United States, do you know?

N: Yes, I do. I have the dates and I have written this book or the manuscript and in it I have given the accurate dates of each one as they came to America, and what they did and all about them and how they got started in the United States, In the state of Iowa, and their pilgrimage over from Denmark, how it was all these three boys that were... I always spoke of them as the three musketeers because they had always., been together. They started school together and they finished life together.

B: Just on the off chance that the manuscript doesn't survive and this tape does, can you give us an approximate date at which your mother emigrated?

N: Let's see now ... 1862 or as near as I can make out 49 no 152 must have been before 160 it must have been 159 or 160 because this eldest brother sent back money to Germany to bring the twins over, she was a twin?

B: Were your mother and father married in Europe and emigrated together or did they meet in the United In the United States.

N: They met in Iowa when my mother and her twin brother came out and stayed with the eldest sister who had married a man by the name of Carl Lanz and they lived with them and were learning the language. They went right to school as soon as they came to learn the English language properly and the history of the country that they were adopting.

B: So your mother did speak English.

N: Oh, very well,

B: And your father also?

N: My father spoke it, but not as well as my mother did because he was a careless Dane. He was a great big fellow, over six foot tall and just really a big man. He had the biggest feet I have ever seen and the biggest hands.

B: How about you yourself? What was the first language you spoke as a child?

N: Oh, as a child? Oh, I don't know. I think it was English but it was German too grand-mother came out from Germany later, the children all came out ahead of her. and the her son begged her to come and he was the one who made the money and owned Bunker Hill. He traded his mining claim for Bunker Hill and he built a huge house there, white house, which since I came here the last eight years was moved over to Pasadena and someone burned these three old homes that had been left on Bunker Hill.  Now they Bunker Hill down of course, and there is nothing there. That's 1972. And when he built that must have been in eighteen eighty four, before I was born. I was born in l885 in Iowa.

B: Did, What was the language of communication of anger? hunger? Your mother being German, your father being Danish. Did your father speak German.

N:Yes he spoke... No, No, My mother never let anybody let ahead of her. She was a small one. She wasn't quite five foot two, but she ruled the... This is a cute little story if you want to hear it. When he got up in the morning she was always all ways at the breakfast table in her white apron with a big bow in the back and her hair done just so with a little black velvet bow in the front, and she served the breakfast poured the coffee, and all that then when he got up to go to business he would always lay a sliver dollar beside her plate and he would say " Now Momma, that's for you and don't you buy anything for the children with it. Every morning.

B: A dollar at that time was a considerable amount of money.

N: It surly was it surely was. When eggs were five cents a dozen and your could get liver given to you and steak was about 15cts a pound at the very best meat.

B: And then it sounded like it was a very international family and did you live in a town in Iowa that at the time that was mainly German and Danish.

N: No there were not very many Danes. It was in the Eastern part of Iowa, close to DeBuke, it was just about 50 miles south of Debuke where I was born, Charlotte. It was a real German settlement, but they wanted a blacksmith and of course these three Danish boys came into New York and they found that there was a sort of place where you could know where you could )et employment or not, where you wanted to go or where they could use you. So he signed up as a blacksmith so when this Carl Lanz sent in his request for a young fellow from Europe to take over the blacksmithing part of his establishment, he was a wagon builder at that time. So they sent him out and then the other boys followed later to get near where this Hans was. There were the three of them. There names where Hans.  There were Hans Cokia , Hans Lund, and what was the other fellows name, I can't remember, it will come to me cause there were three of them. They always went together every place. But, so they always worked there under this wagon maker, Carl Lans, who was my mother's brother in law, you see married to my mother's eldest sister and they all lived together there in a big house, she boarded them and that is where my mother met him. When he came down the trail, he had put all his tools in his carpet bag, but his underwear and all extra clothing that he couldn't get oh his body, he had stuffed in his pockets, and here was a trail behind him of a leg of a red suit of underwear. And my mother saw that and she said " Oh my, I wouldn't marry a man like that. " They had been teasing her that she was to pick out her future among those three boys that where coming out from Denmark. So she shook her head and said "Oh no, I'll never marry him. " Ha Ha Ha! It was ridiculous.

B: Let's go back a bit to Europe, if we might before the American immigration. Beyond your great-grandmother, who was probably Spanish, do you know anything earlier than that?

N: No.

B: You don't?

N: Definitely not.

B: Let's turn then to your father's background and his family in Denmark. How far back do you know?

N: Well, that would be hundreds of years, because they belonged to the Lund Clan, L U N D, which means forest, trees you see, forest woods, whatever you want. Like the Black Forest of Germany. Now they could have originated down there but this clan moved up into Denmark. They where big men wild men, and really ugly.

B: do you know anything about your father's father, your grandfather?

Noon's father's father, yes, the Lunds. He was a Lund too and in that clan Tyley married Lunds because they were distant cousins, way back you see they just formed a clan there. They were all Lunds. And they took a piece of land, I don't know how they got it, but they got this big, rather large piece of land right in there right in the border of Germany and Denmark and it was farm land. But they , it was trees, mostly trees too at that time and Riva Donkirk was right on the sea and they were in from the sea only a short distance, I imagine under 25 miles and that church had been built by the Romans and the cobblestone road that the Romans built went right through the little village of Y", where my father was born. I walked on that and I say that it was really cobblestones and they will always be there for millions of years they will never, unless an earthquake disrupts them, but they are still there.

B: So, you did know your father's father or did you ever meet him?

N: I never met him, but he had this eye trouble too. He was blind and an awful crank.

B: I see.

N: Awfully hot-headed.

B: Do you know anything about his father or mother?

N: No. Not a thing
.
B: I see.

N: That is as far as I know on my father's side of the family.

B: Let's turn now to Granddad's family. What do you know about Granddad's father and mother. You knew them personally, didn't you?

N: No, Yes, oh yes! My husband's mother and father, oh sure I did. His mother was a Vanderlip from the early Vanderlip's that settled of Germans that settled in Pennsylvania. And she was a grand woman, just a marvellous woman. She too had heart trouble and it took her She was only 54 when she passed on. But I loved that woman dearly and she was so sweet and kind to everyone and she had such a hard life in raising these this family. There were eight children and my husband had to leave school when he was only twelve years old and work to help feed them. And she was the village seamstress and that was in Saint Thomas, Ontario or just but of Saint Thomas always and that's. She came from Michigan. Her father had been one of the Vanderlips who had gone out into the wilds of Michigan, so she had no chance to go to school or anything, but she was a regal looking woman and she had a regal mind. She was a wonderful person. But, the father, do you want me to 'tell the truth about him?

B: Well that is what we are looking for on thus is the truth as far as we can get.

N: Okay I just called him a snotty little Englishman. That is what he was. He treated, he would just make a fuss over me oh dear, ah I couldn't take it. But his wife he treated her like dirt and she was wonderful, she was a perfect lady in my estimate. But he had his good points. He was the secretary of the Loans Aid in the church and he was secretary of the... oh what do you call the first ones who came on the Mayflower you know?

B: The Pilgrims.

N: Yes, but it wasn't in the States, it was in Canada. What are they called?

B: The United Empire Loyalists.

N: Yes! Well what are the ladies called? Don't you know?

B: Daughters of the Empire?

N: Daughters of the Empire. He was the secretary for them and oh my he would go out... he couldn't put it over on me.

B: So he was from England, was he?

N: Oh, yes. B: Do you know where?

N: Yes, yes. Essexx in the Exeter was the name of the city, wouldn't it
be?

B: I believe so.

N: Exited, Essex Essex, Exeter?

B: Essex is the area.

N: Essex is the area. And what did I say?

B: Exeter.

N: Exeter was the city. And he was one of the last of the Von Tromp's which they claim was the old admiral who swept the British of the sea and left a lot of bastards so that you could believe. I am reminded of. So I told that to you one day and you were so cross about it. Don't you tell me that I am a bastard a bastard child. I said you probably were because that was the story that I got.

B: I suppose I don't remember that incident. It must have been years ago.

N: Don't you? Oh, it was when you were just a little fellow.

B: I suppose that everybody is if you go back far enough. Do you have any idea of when Granddad's father came out to Canada.

N: Oh yes, oh yes. He came out as a six -year old boy and he was ... There were two boys born to that union and she was a Thornton and because there were no boys left in the Thornton family they were dying out. So the parents said well you can marry Von Tromp but he has to take off the Von and put the Thornton in front of it. So they paid for that those days. And that's how it became hyphenated.
 
B: Well you mean this hyphenation began with Granddad's father?

N: Absolutely, absolutely.

B: He was the who took the Thornton name, --granddad's father? His father.

N: No, no. His father. Then there were these two boys, you see, were born of this union of the Thornton and the Von Tromp.

B: I see.

N: And so that is where you get your Dutch as well as your English. But mother was a Vanderlip, but her mother was a Freidland F R E I D L A N D.

B: Canada from England.

N: Oh, he must I have come, let me see, would be....

B: Around the 1850's, in there.

N: Her ancestors were through the Duke of Freidland who went up to fight for Prince Charles in Scotland and he was given the tract of land where Edinburgh now stands, and that must have been in the 16th century as near as I can remember my history. Can you remember? It is in General History? You should you're recent. In General History. General History usually has a picture of him, you see, in his Dutch cap when he lead his cavalry.
 
B: For Prince Charles? Bonnie Prince Charley? Was tie in on the Battle of Caloden?

N: Well I don't know about that! That I couldn't say, but he brought his Calvary up from Germany. There you see, there is another German bind between the, your people and the Scotch. And anyway, she was of this original Freidland and she tried to trace it and she had a minister who was trying to help her, but they never seemed to be able to get together enough money to pay for having what they would need to do in order to get the.... but they did get some papers. And then through jealousy someone on the other side of the house got a hold of the papers and destroyed and burned them. So she really didn't have anything, she had no proof.

B: What, about what year then would. Granddad's father have come out to?

N: I would imagine around the late 1850's or the early 1860's.
 
B: I see.

N: Perhaps later, might have been even later than that in the 1870's.

B: I see.

N: Because he was six years old when he came out.

B: Aside from the fact that it was his father who began the hyphenated name do you know anything else about his father, granddad's grandfather or beyond that?

N: No I don't know anything at all only I know that they lived in Essex, in the city of Exeter. That is all I know, because then you see, those girls the one that didn't take the, his mother died, your great-grandfather's mother died and then he was sent to America to this woman, who was the sister-in-law, his sister-in law, the sister, and the father died over there, so he was left an orphan. The two boys were orphans and they were sent first one and then the other. You see. The youngest one was sent over first and he was only six. And she took them and that was Aunt Selina Ware, her name was Ware and her husband had more than one hotel in... one in New York and one close to Toronto someplace. And that is how he became an Ontario boy. He was raised there and they put him a ... to learn laws. They wrote out the laws in those days, you see penman and so he was studying the law and writing this and that is where he got his education, but he was very young, he was only 19 when he was married and she was only 16 and your grandfather was born the first year before she was 17 years old, she had him, He was the eldest one in the family. And he was not well at all. He had an extremely large head Now I am telling this for your benefit. And they called it water on the brain at that time and he never walked until he was after three years old, he just lay in a crib. But he learned to talk, but he did not learn to walk or he could not carry himself until after he was three years old and then he just seemed to begin to be quite normal and by the time he was sixteen he was a tall, very slight, all of them were very slight in that family they didn't get enough to eat that's the trouble, but, he got plenty after he was married because I liked to cook and I still like to cook.

B: Well, about Granddad's mother, do you know anything back...

N: Well only that she was a Vanderlip from the old family of the Dutch in Pennsylvania. That's all I know. and he was one of the younger boys and left home early and made a way for himself in Michigan and then they... I really don't know anything about them outside of that.

B: I see. Well if we could turn now to maybe something a little bit more general. This is 1972 at the time we are talking and your 87 years old, which means that you were born when 18....

N: 1885 in...

B: 1885. So that. .

N: In Clinton County, Charlotte, Iowa,

B: I see. And.. .

N: And I have my birth certificate. In fact I had to give it to them when I want to get this tax rebate.

B: That means then that you were 15 years old at the turn of the century. You can remember then the beginning of the twentieth century

N: Oh sure! That is when I went to Canada.

B: I see. So...

N: That's when I came up here. This is Canada I'm in now isn't it.

B: Yes. So...

N: Vancouver, Canada. I get confused.

B: If you were born in 1885 and it is now 1972, your life span has gone through an era in which there has been more fantastic and wide spread change than any other era in human history.

Nonie : That is true.

B: Do you feel often that you are living in an entirely different world now
than the one you were born into?

N: Oh, no, no, but I had a good brain and I was quite well developed at 15. I had the mentality they told me, I. Well I had my entrance into university I made an application for to Amass Iowa before it was started, just when they were getting ready to start Ames Iowa the state college. And my principle sent in my name and my credits and they said she has the mental ability, she has, but she is too young. We can't take them until they are 16. So that is when I came to Canada.

B: But I was thinking more of physical conditions. The fantastic difference in life style now say to the time you were a little girl...

N: Well. . .

B: When I was in Nebraska last summer, I was surprised to finding looking through the museum in Lincoln that some of the last Indian Wars in that area occurred after you were born. .

N: Oh, sure...

B: and when you were a little girl. Do you actually remember some of the Indian Wars.

N: I definitely do, not the horrors because it was before I, we came out to the western part of the state. But there had been the big Indian massacre at Spirit Lake and on the Okaboja just a short time before we came out. We came out in the very early spring in March so that my father could get it up more. He had bought this small piece of land because he had lost his one eye and he couldn't operate his bellows, you see, and the blacksmith. And so he had doing his time there in Charlotte, he had designed this, the iron harrow which is still being used on the land today only it has been changed a little, more modern. But it still hangs on the back of the big tractors that till the land. And he had designed this and so he went to Chicago and out to Dearborn where John Dear was and he got acquainted with him and showed him this and said Hans I'd like to buy that. What do you want for it ? And my father said "Well I don't know. What do you think it is worth?" Well, he says, would $600. 00 suit you? No, my father said, I think it should be, . . it would be worth more than that. But he says, "Tell you what, you can have it for $750. 00 if you'll manufacture it and give me a royalty for a few years. So they made a deal. So then he took that $750. 00 and went into business for himself in Milord, Iowa, in the machine business, And there he designed the Knoter on the McCormic Binder and he got a few hundred dollars for that and by the time he had been there ten years, he built it up and sold his place for ten thousand dollars cash and he took all the equipment that he needed for a farm to Red Deer, Alberta where he bought this land and I've told all about that in my manuscript too, how that was arranged. That, that was my father.

B: You've lived through a time that to most people today is history only encountered in history books...

N: Ya ya

B: You must have a personal memory of such things as the Wright Brothers first heavier than air flight, for example....

N: Oh, that was years and years after that. The Wright Brothers. That was after we went to Vancouver.

B: Yah that was 1913, wasn't it around.... that

N: 1913, Yes that was the first and the first we ever saw anything of it was right after the First World War when we bought our place the in Point Gray.

B: I see, but you remember this news at the time, do you. The first heavier than air flight.. .

N: Oh, yes, oh, yes everything, definitely.

B: Everybody talking about it.. .

N: Oh, yes. I can even remember when the first lights went on in Chicago. My father, you see, was also buying stock. He got the farmers coming and going because he bought their stock and sent it to Chicago and Omaha you know, for slaughtering then ugh... and then he was. . they called him cattle buyer. But that was only part of his business, but any ways that's ugh... I am off the track now, . . What was that.

B: Yes, I want to...

N: The electric lights! He was in Chicago when the electric lights were first turned on.

B: I see. Well I am kind of interested in getting because there aren't very many people alive today who can remember...

N: No!

B: . . . these things as actual experienced events.

N: Yes.

B: You recall, no doubt, you have memories of the Spanish American War.
Do you?

N: Definitely, definitely. I recited the poem at the last entertainment when school was out that day. Remember the Maim, and if you do, if this isn't be thy deed, Oh, so and so as the nations creed, thou will diest with the Manim. And Spain did die after that. That is when Spain started to go down.

B: Well, you remember the Boar War, no doubt then?

N: Oh, yes. I remember the Boar War, but the United States wasn't involved any to much in that, and we, just at the very finish of it was I think just finished when we went up to Canada.

B: I see. Does it ever strike you as- strange to think that you were born into an era when the horse was the main mode of transportation, and you have lived to watch the men exploring the moon on colour television?

N: Well, I never expected that would happen in my life, but 1, but as for horses, I was a real horse woman. I loved my horses. And when I taught all those children out there at Hills down, the rode their ponies to school and then they gave me a pony. I never expected any money. I taught them for three years and I got them right straight through. The two eldest boys, I'm proud to say, and I want you to record that because they lead the army of occupation the Canadian Army of Occupation into Germany at the First World War. And I was the only one that ever had taught them academically. After I taught them then they read a great deal and they took the courses. One was a Major and the other one was a Captain.

B: Do you, if you can imagine for a moment that instead of having been born in 1885 and being 87 in the year 1972, if you had been born let's say in 1500 and lived to 87 in 1587, the world as you knew it in your old age would be pretty much the same as the one you were born into. Now it happened that you were born just at the beginning of an era of tremendous change. Do you think that you would have preferred to have lived in a stable world like the world between 1500 to 1587 or have you enjoyed living through this fantastic change.

N: Oh, I have enjoyed it immensely! Every change. I say I have lived such a full and complete life that know wonder I say I am ready to go because I've had such a marvellous life.

B: Do you believe that most of the change that has taken place in your life-time has been for the good of humanity as a whole or....

N: Oh, definitely ,! It is so wonderful the way the young people are taken care of now, and all the people, and the old people. We're so much better of than any of the generations that I have lived through.
 
B: You wouldn't like to see the world again as it was in 1890, let's say.

N: Oh, no definitely not. No. I have enjoyed every phase of it, understand.  I have enjoyed it because I matured very young as you can see and I really have enjoyed living with each generation, each ten years was the differences that have been made. I have enjoyed it immensely.

B: For most of your life it has been a time of great optimism and the technological changes that were taking place were to lead mankind on to bigger and greater things.

N: Absolutely!

B: But, in the past 5 to 10 years a reaction has begun to set in and people have begun to say now with all this technological change we've ruined the planet through pollution, we are in danger of becoming of becoming extinct and some people are saying now we must stop for the growth and change if we are to survive. How do you feel about that?

N: I don't think we should. I feel we should keep right on and I think that we should be given, that the young people of today should all have free education if they have made their required credits.

B:. How do you feel. . .

N: They should be helped in every way because we are going on and on, up and up.

B: How do you feel about some of the young people today who are saying enough is enough we are smothering ourselves and the thing to do is to simplify life, to get out of the cities back to the land, back to the basics- of existence, and forget this rapid technological change. They are looking for a type of world like the one that you were born into perhaps. What would you say to those young people?

N: I would tell them to just stop and think. We are definitely going up and on to better things all the time. Think of what Science has done for us. Just think of the difference in the way people are cared for now, say in the medical world for instance. And it is the same in the scientific world, the science.  It is the he who wants to work, he who wants to advance. It's there, it's there, all for the taking, all for just doing and thinking of helping others. I do believe in equality, understand. I do believe that people should be level where anything above that, when you have a half a dozen homes or you have more than what you can absolutely need or make use of, then I do think that should go back to the government and that should help to pay for those who have not been so fortunate financially, but perhaps they have gotten. much more out of life by living a simple life, and having the prayer. My prayer has been repeated three times in our little paper. Just to let me do something for others, think of others not so much for yourself.

B: So you feel then a certain sympathy towards people who say are in their teens and early twenties now, who say crass materialism isn't enough and that is what their parents believed in, that more and better material things would bring greater happiness. They didn't question this. You agree with the young people that this is.

N: Oh, definitely, definitely, I am all for the young people. Especially for those that use their mind, that will think beyond the end of their nose, that will say I'll look at that fellows side and I'll look at that fellows side, both sides and then form their own conclusions through their own brain through their own ability to think, and then go ahead and do it. They will make our leaders, and that's what I expect out of these of today. We are going to have some wonderful leaders. You wait and see. I may not live that long, but you will.

B: If you were to chose, if you had to chose, a particular decade of your life to live through again, would you be able to make a choice? Which decade would you chose?

N: Well, I don't know about it. I think perhaps it would be when I first came up to Canada when I was 15 years old until I was married. I had a grand time. I had a marvelous time. I was voted the best looking girl in Alberta by the cowboys. That alone made me think I must have looked nice anyway. I had long dark red hair, it was slightly wavy and I had a nice. . . I had a good figure. I was curvaceous and they voted me that and they all would bring me boxes of candy and I enjoyed it. I just thought it was wonderful. But I never thought of it... Marriage , was nothing further from my mind until after I was 21, mind you, I was having too good a time for anything serious.

B: Of all the social and political events which have taken place in the world within your memory, such things as those early Indian Wars, which you at least heard about, the Spanish American War, the Boar War, World War 1, World War 2, the Depression in the 130's, which social or political event do you think had the greatest effect on you personally in your lifetime?

N: Well, having... I don't know. I can't say for sure whether it was the years when I taught all those children that would never had a chance to go to school in their early days. They would have gone after they were well in their teens, because the government came in and built schools and we even had a hospital, but I think that those were the most productive years that I lived because I was doing such wonderful things to help people, being a natural nurse, you see and wanting to help and wanting to be. . . I enjoyed that most. That was of course in the... that was in from 1904 to 1908, let's say. In through there. I, oh, I felt that I was really something because I could help others. I really had that in my mind.

B: What I really meant in my question was which great social or political event that took place in your lifetime do you think had the most influence upon you personally, we might say such things as the 1917 Revolution in Russia, World War i, World War 2, and so on. Which do you think influenced you personally most?

N: Well, I couldn't say because there are so many things to influence me. because I had an open mind and I was always thinking more of the ones that were really having a bad time of it.

B: What I mean...

N: That influenced my mind ...

B: What I mean is which influenced the life you were leading most, which had its effects upon you?

N: That I was leading? I don't know, I don't know. I can't say. Of course the late wars were the wars that I gave the most when I gave eight of my boys first my own four in the second world war, and then in the... my two in-laws, and then my two grandsons. Oh, God was good to me, I didn't lose any of them, but I lost their health was gone in many of the cases, not all of them. There was some very bad things happen to them my boys, too. That hurt me. That was the biggest hurt that I had.

B: How about the depression in the 130's? Was that worse?

N: Well not for me personally because my husband was making a good salary though it was cut in half. We could I could do more for others, which I did. I helped feed that didn't have and I tried to do it in a way that it wouldn't hurt their feelings or feel that it was charity. That whenever I put anything into the oven I always put an extra one or two little smaller than one of the children would take it where we thought it was needed &I know it was appreciated.
 
B: This is a difficult question, but in the very few minutes in the tape we have left, what little bit of advice would you give young people today?
 
N: Oh, A happy mind makes a healthy body.

B: Thank you very much.

B: That was an interview with Nonie, recorded during her last visit to Vancouver in an attempt to preserve as much family history as possible, for as long as possible. The interview was conducted by Bill Trump, a grandson, Present also were the interviewer's wile, Lurana Trump, and Penny Day, a granddaughter. If you who hear this are a descendent of Nonie, either naturally or by adoption somewhere among the intervening generations and if you would like a copy of this recording for yourself and your descendants, it is yours for the asking. Simply write, sending your name and address to:

Bill Trump
3305 East 24th Avenue,
Vancouver, British Columbia,
Canada.

This is Bill Trump in Vancouver.

January 28, 1975.